Torture

Now that we have some of the most damning evidence yet pointing fingers
to top administration officials in the approval of torture, Congress
must investigate and the Hague should also investigate for war crimes:

Bush administration officials from Vice President Dick Cheney on down signed off on using harsh interrogation techniques against suspected terrorists after asking the Justice Department to endorse their legality, The Associated Press has learned.

The officials also took care to insulate President Bush from a series of meetings where CIA interrogation methods, including waterboarding, which simulates drowning, were discussed and ultimately approved.

A former senior U.S. intelligence official familiar with the meetings described them Thursday to the AP to confirm details first reported by ABC News on Wednesday. The intelligence official spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to publicly discuss the issue.

I don't care if Bush and Cheney only have 9 months left in office. Just because they leave the White House doesn't mean any laws broken during their tenure are forgotten. If Congress cares at all about America, or what America once stood for, then they will work to see justice prevail in this case. We need to send a message to the world that America does not stand behind these practices, and those that try to pull us into the abyss will face the full effect of the law.

It's also very interesting that the techniques which were approved by the administration echo the treatment of detainees at Abu Gharib. Remember the administration's defense on that? "They were acting on their own". Bullshit. It now looks like they were acting within a secret policy and the administration made them fall guys for what happened. That's a great way to treat our soldiers - let them take the blame for laws we break.

Is it any wonder why people are reluctant to serve our nation anymore?

When you want to be President so much that you are willing to sell out your very soul, then you are neither presidential or a man. You, John McCain, are nothing but a lying hypocrite and a disgrace to this nation.

More like bullshitter. John McCain voted against a torture ban today. I guess him being President means more than human rights. This guy is a total disgrace.

But to his defense he is a conservative.

Anyone surprised? I want to again thank Chuck and Di for handing us this new AG - same as the old AG.

Easy - if a judge wants to see some tapes, just destroy them!

At the time that the Central Intelligence Agency destroyed videotapes of the interrogations of operatives of Al Qaeda, a federal judge was still seeking information from Bush administration lawyers about the interrogation of one of those operatives, Abu Zubaydah, according to court documents made public on Wednesday.

The court documents, filed in the case of Zacarias Moussaoui, appear to contradict a statement last December by Gen. Michael V. Hayden, the C.I.A. director, that when the tapes were destroyed in November 2005 they had no relevance to any court proceeding, including Mr. Moussaoui's criminal trial.

It was already known that the judge in the case, Leonie M. Brinkema, had not been told about the existence or destruction of the videos. But the newly disclosed court documents, which had been classified as secret, showed the judge had still been actively seeking information about Mr. Zubaydah's interrogation as late as Nov. 29, 2005.

What would happen to you or me if we did something like this? This is just another example of how the Bush administration feels they are above any laws, and our Congress lets them continue. This is the outrage that will mock our country for generations to come.

Seriousley - if this guy can't even decide if it is legal or not, then how can he decide if someone should be prosecuted or not? This is the great legal mind that Schumer and Feinstein delivered us? What a joke!

Over 80 lawyers for detainees at gitmo are supporting Barack Obama for President. This should really be a glowing endorsement for him, but I doubt it will get much play in the media.

That is from a federal judge:

A federal judge said Thursday that CIA interrogation videotapes may have been relevant to his court case, and he gave the Bush administration three weeks to explain why they were destroyed in 2005 and say whether other evidence was destroyed.

Several judges are considering wading into the dispute over the videos.

But U.S. District Judge Richard W. Roberts was the first to order the administration to provide a written report on the matter.

You can bet that this will be going on long after Bush is out of office. We just need to make sure he doesn't leave the country.

That according to Tom Ridge

The first secretary of the Homeland Security Department says waterboarding is torture.

"There's just no doubt in my mind — under any set of rules — waterboarding is torture," Tom Ridge said Friday in an interview with the Associated Press. Ridge had offered the same opinion earlier in the day to members of the American Bar Association at a homeland security conference.

No wonder why the administration got rid of him - he sounds like a silly liberal.

That's what the nation's chief spook said:

The nation's intelligence chief says that waterboarding "would be torture" if used against him, or if someone under interrogation was taking water into his lungs.

But Mike McConnell declined for legal reasons to say whether the technique categorically should be considered torture.

So we now are a nation of selective law - laws that only apply to certain people, but get ignored for others. Bullshit. It's time for congress to really focus on this issue and take whatever steps are necessary. I don't care if an impeachment vote is held on January 19th, 2009, we need it on record that this nation as a whole condemns the actions of this President and his administration.

A blow to the administration - their will now be hearings into the destruction of the waterboarding tapes.

Of course we are talking about torture, and the bill Bush wants to veto is the intelligence bill that passed in the House yesterday, mostly across party lines:

The White House threatened to veto the measure this week in a lengthy statement, highlighting more than 11 areas of disagreement with the bill.

The administration particularly opposes restricting the CIA to interrogation methods approved by the military in 2006. That document prohibits forcing detainees to be naked, perform sexual acts, or pose in a sexual manner; placing hoods or sacks over detainees' heads or duct tape over their eyes; beating, shocking, or burning detainees; threatening them with military dogs; exposing them to extreme heat or cold; conducting mock executions; depriving them of food, water, or medical care; and waterboarding.

Two things come to mind when reading this. First - isn't all this already illegal? I mean if we outlaw this stuff, what is to say they don't come up with something new that is just a little outside these definitions? No your honor, I didn't kill a man. Instead I expedited his journey to meet his maker, which isn't against the law verbatim. Perhaps Congress should tell Bush that he has to follow the laws we already have or face impeachment. Oh wait - Harry and Nancy wouldn't do that.

Now the second thing coming to mind on this is the fact that Republicans largely support torture. This bill needs to become a corner stone on the campaign trails next year. Remind people how disturbed this country was when our soldiers faced harsh treatments from their captures in Iraq. After that ask them how we can say that is wrong when we do the same thing. That is the very reason for the Geneva conventions, and Bush, along with the entire GOP, wants to ignore that, which is truly amazing for people who don't have anything at stake in the current conflicts. Maybe Barb or Jenna should get stacked naked in a pyramid or get waterboarded. I wonder how Bush would like that then.

I have had jobs in management and owned my own company, and if anyone blatantly defied something I said needed to be done, they would either be looking for a job or be reassigned to a lessor capacity. So why doesn't the chief executive of this country follow such a simple business philosophy?

When news first came out about the waterboarding tapes being destroyed, we found out Harriet Miers even had the common sense to say no. The CIA ignored that and did it anyways. Now, in the very sense of checks and balances, we find out the CIA destroyed them despite court orders:

The Bush administration was under court order not to discard evidence of detainee torture and abuse months before the CIA destroyed videotapes that revealed some of its harshest interrogation tactics.

Normally, that would force the government to defend itself against obstruction allegations. But the CIA may have an out: its clandestine network of overseas prisons.

While judges focused on the detention center in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and tried to guarantee that any evidence of detainee abuse would be preserved, the CIA was performing its toughest questioning half a world away. And by the time President Bush publicly acknowledged the secret prison system, interrogation videotapes of two terrorism suspects had been destroyed.

Now I know the Democrats are scared of being labeled "weak on terrorism" if they go after Bush or his bumbling band of Keystone Kops to harshly. To quote the great philosopher Kermit the Frog; "it isn't easy being green". I understand that, so I want to offer a new tactic. Any person or organizations trying to undermine and destroy the basic foundations of our nation, like three equal branches of government and checks and balances, must be classified a terrorist. This includes George Bush, Dick Cheney and anyone who follows their illegal orders like little puppets.

Tell the people you are protecting us from a terrorist organization that is far more dangerous than al Qaeda - a terrorist organization that is trying to destroy the very fabric of our freedom. After 9/11 Bush said they attacked us "because they hate our freedoms". Well his illegal stripping of those freedoms should be considered an attempt to aide our ally. That in itself is treason. Tell George Bush him and his Justice Department has had numerous chances to prove they stand for the United States in investigating their countless scandals, but instead have let the American people down. The entire Bush regime must be declared a terrorist organization and Congress must pursue that organization with utmost vigilance.

I'm not scared of terrorists hiding in caves wanting to hurt us, I am terrified of a rogue administration who wants nothing more than to dismantle our country and everything it once stood for. An administration lead by a person whose very own grandfather wanted to see this country destroyed and helped the Nazis rise to power. The Republicans said Clinton's administration ignored the threat of terrorism and that lead to 9/11. Well we are now ignoring this new threat of terrorism and the consequences of that would be far greater than 10,000 9/11s.

That is exactly what the CIA has done:

The CIA destroyed videotapes it made in 2002 of two top terror suspects because it was afraid that keeping them "posed a security risk," Director Michael Hayden has told agency employees.

Hayden's revelation to the CIA employees became public Thursday and it caused a commotion on Capitol Hill where members of the Senate Intelligence Committee immediately vowed to conduct a thorough review. A leading human rights group voiced alarm about it.

In his message to agency workers, Hayden said that House and Senate intelligence committee leaders had been informed of the existence of the tapes and the CIA's intention to destroy them to protect the identities of the questioners. He also said the CIA's internal watchdog watched the tapes in 2003 and verified that the interrogation practices were legal. Hayden said the tapes were destroyed three years after the 2002 interrogations.

If you or me destroyed evidence we would face criminal charges. Some how I doubt that will be the case. In our corrupt capital, the rule of law takes the backseat to everything else.